I've had this argument twice today already ... and it's only going to get worse
Jhonny Rico (11:49:16 AM): SNAKES ON A PLANE
DaveArchie (11:50:07 AM): I'm not seeing it
Jhonny Rico (11:50:27 AM): i think you meant to say "i'm getting drunk on the way to the theater before i see it"
DaveArchie (11:50:29 AM): I think I need to write a ten-page paper on why it would be the downfall of America if as many people see this as I think are going to
DaveArchie (11:50:39 AM): it's the opposite of art
Jhonny Rico (11:50:44 AM): yeah
Jhonny Rico (11:50:50 AM): but it makes no pretense about being art
DaveArchie (11:50:54 AM): it's a completely meta view of pandering to the lowest common denominator
DaveArchie (11:51:15 AM): yeah, but the lack of pretense is egregious
DaveArchie (11:51:38 AM): because it's not trying to be "unintentionally funny" or "campy" or even "so good it's bad"
DaveArchie (11:52:05 AM): it's trying to be "commercially successful because a bunch of people will see it because of how self-awaredly terrible it is"
DaveArchie (11:52:26 AM): there's not even an artistic pretense to the lack of artistic integrity
Jhonny Rico (11:52:44 AM): a great number of things are commercially successful for worse reasons
DaveArchie (11:52:57 AM): I disagree
DaveArchie (11:53:06 AM): or maybe that is true
DaveArchie (11:53:37 AM): but it's like shining a light at the Statue of Liberty and saying to America, "Give me your stupid, your foolish, your shallow ... but most of all, give me your money"
Jhonny Rico (11:53:47 AM): i think it would be worse if they had retitled it "pacific flight 93" and tried to make it more dramatic or what have you. i think there's a certain purity to its simplicity of purpose. it's just samuel l. jackson and snakes on a plane
Jhonny Rico (11:53:53 AM): yeah but hollywood's been doing that for YEARS
DaveArchie (11:53:57 AM): yes
Jhonny Rico (11:53:59 AM): at least this time they aren't bullshitting about it
DaveArchie (11:54:02 AM): yes
DaveArchie (11:54:06 AM): but that makes it worse
DaveArchie (11:54:29 AM): because now the people are saying, "Yes, I hate art. Yes, I like the most shallow and base and worthless elements of human existence."
DaveArchie (11:57:05 AM): before they were just being kind of cowed into implicitly stating that
DaveArchie (11:57:10 AM): now they are actively saying it
Jhonny Rico (12:00:00 PM): i'm not sure if that's worse though. obviously it's better if the people prefer art but i think it's better for the masses if they're honest about what they want, even if what they want sucks. i mean we already knew the masses don't have taste. now they know it too
Jhonny Rico (12:01:01 PM): i'd much prefer if they reached higher in their ambitions
Jhonny Rico (12:01:04 PM): but they're not going to
Jhonny Rico (12:01:05 PM): and we know it
DaveArchie (12:01:36 PM): it would just restore my faith in humanity so much if people said, "This looks like a piece of shit. I'm not going to see this fucking piece of shit."
DaveArchie (12:02:00 PM): I mean, this isn't like Armageddon where people actually thought it was going to be good (and some even liked it)
DaveArchie (12:02:07 PM): nobody thinks this is going to be good
DaveArchie (12:02:11 PM): even the people making it
Jhonny Rico (12:03:49 PM): i think the people-- at least the ones who've thought it through at all, and the rest were never going to anyway-- are more excited about being a part of this moment of cultural absurdity
DaveArchie (12:04:15 PM): it reminds me of the Wilco song "Hell Is Chrome"
DaveArchie (12:04:23 PM): Satan just makes it look so fucking sweet
Jhonny Rico (12:06:54 PM): yeah
I'm listening to my "Everything Sucks, Nothing Has Ever Been Good" playlist
"You Were Right" - Built To Spill
"Depression" - Black Flag
"Life Stinks" - Rocket From the Tombs
"Bastards Of Young" - Replacements
"Gasoline Dreams" - OutKast
"Four Leaf Clover" - Old 97's
"Lounge Act" - Nirvana
"Dark Center Of The Universe" - Modest Mouse
"Arbeit Macht Frei" - The Libertines
"Ballad Of The Sin Eater" - Leo, Ted
"Angry Inch" - Sleater-Kinney
"Institutionalized" - Suicidal Tendencies
"A Perfect Teenhood" - And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Dead
"EMI" - Sex Pistols
"Sex Sux (amen)" - Vaselines
"No Culture Icons" - Thermals
"Aenema" - Tool
"Like a Rolling Stone (Live)" - Dylan, Bob
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